turtledovefandomcom-20200216-history
Talk:Bibliography
I think we should organize the short stories by anthologies. Speaking of anthologies, we should also mention ones he's edited, like the Alternate Generals series and The First Heroes, and collections of his work, like Departures, Kaleidoscope, and Counting Up, Counting Down. Turtle Fan 07:19, 28 December 2008 (UTC) So, for example: Counting Up Counting Down (collection) *Contents: *1 *2 *3 TR 07:25, 28 December 2008 (UTC) Correct. Turtle Fan 17:20, 29 December 2008 (UTC) Good job, TR. I think it might be better still to attach short stories that appeared in anthologies HT edited to said anthologies. "The Horse of Bronze" goes with The First Heroes; I forget which Alternate Generals stories go where, or I'd do it myself. (Wasn't "The Charge of the Light Brigade" the AGI story? That's the one where Lee fights in the Crimean War, right? Damn, I actually wish Darwin were here; he was quite a fan of that story.) I moved "Trantor Falls" to the shared universe category. It seems wrong to call Asimov's universe "shared," but in the context of Foundation's Friends, that is correct. Turtle Fan 21:05, 29 December 2008 (UTC) :I'd forgotten to move Trantor Falls, thanks. :We can move the other stories, sure. TR 21:23, 29 December 2008 (UTC) ::Later tonight I'll check Amazon to remind myself of what goes where. I've still got The First Heroes around here somewhere, if I can find it; I think I lost or maybe even threw out Alternate Generals years ago. I found that one disappointing and never read the sequels. Turtle Fan 21:25, 29 December 2008 (UTC) :::The Light Brigade story was in the first AG. TR 21:27, 29 December 2008 (UTC) ::::Did Turtledove write it? Turtle Fan 21:32, 29 December 2008 (UTC) :::::Stirling, actually. HT's contribution was "The Phantom Tolbukhin". :::::I never actually read AG1. Having read mixed reviews, and having the one HT story in it in another collection, I didn't see much point. TR 21:36, 29 December 2008 (UTC) ::::::There's not much point, except perhaps to read the story where Joshua Chamberlain became a Reb and led the charge against Little Round Top, to find his idiot brother commanding the 20th Maine in his place. (The brother wasn't an idiot in the story, but he was in real life.) The circumstances that would make Chamberlain throw in with the Rebs were rather hard to believe, but the story was pleasant just the same. It was about the only one. ::::::Based on the cover art and the back flap I was expecting a free-for-all anthology in which authors simply mixed and matched generals and battles at random. I thought at the time that that would have been a lot of fun, but thinking back on it now that would be really silly, wouldn't it? Turtle Fan 21:42, 29 December 2008 (UTC) :::::::Many of the negative reviews focused on two things: obscure PODs and false advertising. TR 21:44, 29 December 2008 (UTC) ::::::::Both are valid points. I never bothered finding out whether the other AG volumes correct them. Turtle Fan 21:46, 29 December 2008 (UTC) ::::::I concentrated on the HT stories in the second and third volumes. The bad cover copy is gone from those. The stories I read didn't stand out, although they didn't seem that obscure. TR 21:48, 29 December 2008 (UTC) Re TR's Recent Edits 1. Is Cuba part of Atlantis? I can't remember it ever coming up. :Again, the stories. TR 04:23, October 20, 2009 (UTC) ::If I get really nostalgic for Atlantis after LA's in the books, I might track these stories down. Turtle Fan 15:04, October 20, 2009 (UTC) 2. Why are WHGTY and THTGB released "sometime in 2009"? If we want to say more than 2009, I remember offhand that they came out in March and June, respectively, and beyond that I'm sure it wouldn't be hard to find the dates. Turtle Fan 00:59, October 20, 2009 (UTC) Story Dates This makes life easier. I think I'm going to finish getting the novels squirreled away so the categories will be established, then go back and slide in the stories. So now do we want to reevaluate our plans for the 80s? Turtle Fan 19:08, October 28, 2009 (UTC) :I think each year will have some representation, so yes, every year as a category. TR 19:45, October 28, 2009 (UTC). ::Ah, here is the discussion on short story date of pub. My bad. ::One other thing to consider is that the "Agent" and "Flesh" books could be viewed as collections too. We could put them there instead and have the story titles and dates listed too. I don't know how much HT changed the individual stories to make them read smoother but I suspect not much. ML4E 23:48, October 28, 2009 (UTC) Supervolcano Silver has info on this series on the main web site. Hence it's inclusion here. I hate getting too far ahead on projects, especially when its 2 years or so down the road, but we have a few concrete details on the first book anyway. TR 17:37, March 17, 2010 (UTC) :It's inelegant but we do want this bibliography to be as nearly complete as we can possibly make it. Turtle Fan 19:46, March 17, 2010 (UTC) Tor.com Anyone up for a subcat of Short Stories that includes all the Tor.com stories in one place? It's not really an anthology, but they are all associated with the same project (which I guess is Tor providing some free fluff to increase website traffic.) Turtle Fan 15:37, August 2, 2011 (UTC) :I was thinking about that myself. Create cats for the stories appearing in Analog and Asimov's while we're at it. TR 18:34, August 2, 2011 (UTC) ::Yeah. The Short Stories category is quite large, and while I do like having a few large categories, like Historical Figures or Americans, more often than not it's a sign that a category needs more precise subdivision. Turtle Fan 04:36, August 3, 2011 (UTC) :::I was also thinking that we should have templates for the short stories generally. They seem rather empty compared with the novels and characters. TR 02:07, August 4, 2011 (UTC) ::::Yes, indeed. And some of them are quite lengthy and substantive, so we can't say "There's not enough content there." Well we can with some of them, but a 40- or 50- or 60-page story deserves better. Turtle Fan 03:07, August 4, 2011 (UTC) "Donner Summit" Silver added this. It will be published in Analog in the July-August issue (which probably means it will actually appear on stands in June). I just wanted to draw everyone's attention to it, just because knowing more or less what Donner Summit is, I am very curious as to what the story will be about. TR 21:54, May 2, 2012 (UTC) :Clearly the Donner Party hold a summit to discuss the critical food shortages they are experiencing. ML4E 18:12, May 3, 2012 (UTC) :Maybe it's a world where cannibalism is an accepted social norm but is heavily governed by elaborate conventions, like in Donald Kingsbury's Courtship Rite? Turtle Fan 05:52, May 5, 2012 (UTC) ::Or a more mundane story about a person who goes to Donner Summit and gets eaten by cannibal ghosts? TR 01:49, May 6, 2012 (UTC) :::Could it be about a different Donner altogether? Turtle Fan 16:27, May 6, 2012 (UTC) ::::I had that thought as well. Rather like "Lee at the Alamo" suggests one thing at first glance (you hit it on the nose in the end, TF). A google search reveals that the Donner family of Finland has produced many a person of note. "Donner" is also French for "to give". There's also a crater on the Moon called "Donner" (worth noting given that the story is implicitly a sci-fi piece of some sort). So it needn't be about the Donner Party or the summit on Donner Pass. TR 22:53, May 6, 2012 (UTC) ::We may get an answer within the week. According to Analog's website, the July issue is scheduled to hit stands on May 9th or so. In an interesting coincidence, I'll be in Glenwood Springs, which has at least one bookstore with a sizeable magazine selection, on May 11, and again on May 13. If the story is one of some length, I might snag a copy. If it's a Probability Zero two pager, then I'll probably just browse it in the store and report back. TR 01:56, May 6, 2012 (UTC) :::Ooh, sounds like fun. I love hanging out in bookstores reading highly anticipated stories in magazines. And of course, thanks for going on a factfinding mission for us. Turtle Fan 16:27, May 6, 2012 (UTC) Intro to a Non-Fiction Book on Lincoln So one of today's Daily Deals in the Kindle store was a book published earlier this year titled 366 Days in Abraham Lincoln's Presidency: The Private, Political, and Military Decisions of America's Greatest President by Stephen Wynalda. At $1.99, I bit. (And that price that will still be good for another two or three hours, if anyone's interested, since Amazon's based in California and uses Pacific time for putting up and taking down their limited time offers, etc.) Once I'd downloaded it I was very surprised to see an introduction by none other than Harry Turtledove. It will be a little while before I get a chance to start the book, but I intend to read the intro tomorrow. But anyway, I'm not sure how we want to handle this, or any other intros to non-fiction works that I'm not aware of, on this bibliography page? I didn't notice it anywhere on here, so I'm assuming we were all unaware of this. Now that we know of it, we should definitely include it in some form. We might need to create a new section, especially if there are other intros like this. Turtle Fan (talk) 04:44, December 5, 2014 (UTC) :I freely admit I've been ignoring non-fiction stuff, largely because he's actually done quite a bit of it (articles on Heinlein, his translation of that Byzantine work, et.c), and I haven't felt like doing the leg-work. :I think a "non-fiction" section is probably a good idea, though. TR (talk) 06:03, December 5, 2014 (UTC) ::If you go to the official Turtledove site maintained by Silver, there is a section on non-fiction. Its the right hand column, second from the top, just under FAQ. Some of them look like academic articles while others are intos or essays in collections on various SF and Fantasy authors. ML4E (talk) 21:43, December 5, 2014 (UTC) :::Ah, cool, we can just copy-paste. TR (talk) 22:02, December 5, 2014 (UTC) ::::Looks good, though the introduction I mention is not up there. Actually, but for a single 2011 essay, that whole section looks as though it hasn't been touched in ages. :::::I have added a few more intros that Silver hadn't had in his website. Could you please add the info on the Lincoln book intro TF? Thanks. ML4E (talk) 19:25, December 6, 2014 (UTC) ::::The intro to the Lincoln book, by the way, was not too interesting, and would have been even less so if I hadn't already been following HT's career. He talks about how, when he first started doing research for his early Civil War projects, he was surprised at how different the experience was from studying ancient history. When you do Byzantium or anything from that era or earlier, the challenge is generalizing from a poverty of available primary sources; but when you do something modern, you have too much information and need to pare it down to something manageable while making sure that none of the information you're excluding would openly contradict your thesis. After a couple of pages of musing on this, plus a very brief reminder that a proper historian needs to interpret events as well as accurately recount them, he closes with "This book is an example of that kind of history done well." Turtle Fan (talk) 13:41, December 6, 2014 (UTC) So the format of Wynalda's book lends itself to taking small bites, and I've been doing so these past six months whenever I'm stealing a couple of minutes to read here and there. The book's okay overall, though its quality is uneven. One of its most interesting features is a smattering of side bars that elaborate on some understudied or misunderstood aspect of Lincoln's reputation (or occasionally of that of someone around him, such as his wife's shocking inability to live within the means of even a sitting President's salary). There's a sidebar on his poetry, and it quotes heavily from "My Childhood Home I See Again." It does not, however, include the line from which the title of HFR was drawn. Since the book already had one Turtledovean connection, I was interested to see what I'd have to characterize as a near-miss for another. Turtle Fan (talk) 02:28, June 6, 2015 (UTC) Ordering of Series I just added the Hot War series entry and realized we don't really have an organized ordering of them. A couple of ways come to mind: 1) alphabetic by series name, or 2) genre i.e AH, Fantasy, SF etc. Thoughts? ML4E (talk) 19:28, May 12, 2016 (UTC) :Probably by date of the release of the first volume, oldest to most recent. TR (talk) 19:36, May 12, 2016 (UTC) :Yeah, that might be best. Series titles are not always used consistently, and there are a few ambiguous cases of genre. Turtle Fan (talk) 01:32, May 13, 2016 (UTC)